Fwd: Membership List for South Carolina
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview? ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org> Arvin, Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement. Thanks for all you do, James Brandmair & Harper Sharp -- Arvin Vohra www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634
James, Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency. Love & Liberty, ((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it. -Alicia On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Thank you for the correction, Alicia. It would be helpful, when you point out stuff like this, to include the language of the policy in question, the link to the LNC Policy Manual, and the section # or page # in the document, not just a suggested search term, as the Policy Manual isn't that easy to find on our website. LNC members may know you can get to it by clicking on a different topic ("LNC Meeting Archives") at the bottom of the main LP.org page (even if we can't necessarily recall the 66-page document's contents!) but many others may not. Why the Policy Manual is listed on the "LNC Meeting Archives" page rather than having its own page has never been clear to me (at least not without getting into speculation about possible motives), since it isn't an archive of one of our meetings, but a current governing document. Not only is it buried under an inaccurate heading, but using the site search feature (at the top of the LP.org main page and most if not all other pages in the site) to look for "LNC Policy Manual" doesn't even turn up any search results with that heading! What it does turn up – on the third search result, after two items titled "LNC Meeting" and "LNC 12-10-2016 Meeting - Alexandria", is a result titled "LNC Meeting Archives", and under that link, in smaller non-clickable text, "Libertarian National Committee Policy Manual". Clicking on the "continue reading" link below that takes you to the aforementioned page where the link to the Policy Manual actually appears. And you pretty much have to get to the LNC Policy Manual by clicking through other pages on LP.org in some manner such as described above rather than simply remembering the actual link and typing it into your browser, because as far as I know the document doesn't appear under any simple, logical URL such as "lp.org/policymanual" but instead appears at this link: https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/LNC_Policy_Manual_Adopted_2016... Note that this link is to a PDF document, not a normal webpage. As such, I find that it scrolls much more slowly than most of the material on the site, making it more time-consuming to look through it for information. Anyway, regarding data sharing, "Not quite what our policy is" turns out to be a significant understatement! But I'll address that in the "Membership List for South Carolina" thread, and in a separate motion to revise that section of the Policy Manual. Meanwhile, to address the problems noted above about accessing the Policy Manual and the information it contains, I move the following: MOTION ------------------------------------------------------------------- I move that the LNC direct staff to make the following changes to the website, unless the IT Committee, a member thereof, or other individual who has the necessary website access indicates to the LNC that they can and will see that these changes are made prior to the start of the next LNC meeting on August 19, 2017: 1) Add a link at the bottom of the main page of LP.org labeled "LNC Policy Manual", that links directly to a detailed table of contents for the current version of that document with clickable links for each section and subsection (listed by title), which take viewers to that section or subsection in the full text of the document (on a normal web page rather than a PDF document, at the discretion of those making the changes). 2) Have the URL LP.org/PolicyManual (and/or the URLs LP.org/Policy_Manual, LP.org/LNC_Policy_Manual, and/or LP.org/LNCPolicyManual at the discretion of those making the changes) linked to the current version of the LNC Policy Manual table of contents page described above. ------------------------------------------------------------------- The LNC Policy Manual is a very important document that should not be kept hidden. LP members, not just LNC members, have an interest in knowing what's in it. For instance, the "data sharing with affiliates" section noted by the secretary includes language stating:
"...it is the responsibility of the affiliate chair to make sure the appropriate database contacts are on the database announce e-mail list" [emphasis added]
These common-sense changes will make it faster and easier for all of us to access the document and find what we're looking for in it. I respectfully request my LNC colleagues to co-sponsor the motion. Love & Liberty, ((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF On Jun 5, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Alicia Mattson wrote:
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it.
-Alicia
On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Starchild, I don't think we need a motion for that. I think most of the LNC agrees that the policy manual is hard to find. I think there should probably be a link to it on the bylaws page. That's always the place I think to look. I think there should be a link from the LNC page on the website. And I don't see any reason not to have a link right there with all the other links at the bottom of the LNC page. Daniel Hayes LNC At Large Member Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 5, 2017, at 5:31 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Thank you for the correction, Alicia. It would be helpful, when you point out stuff like this, to include the language of the policy in question, the link to the LNC Policy Manual, and the section # or page # in the document, not just a suggested search term, as the Policy Manual isn't that easy to find on our website. LNC members may know you can get to it by clicking on a different topic ("LNC Meeting Archives") at the bottom of the main LP.org page (even if we can't necessarily recall the 66-page document's contents!) but many others may not.
Why the Policy Manual is listed on the "LNC Meeting Archives" page rather than having its own page has never been clear to me (at least not without getting into speculation about possible motives), since it isn't an archive of one of our meetings, but a current governing document.
Not only is it buried under an inaccurate heading, but using the site search feature (at the top of the LP.org main page and most if not all other pages in the site) to look for "LNC Policy Manual" doesn't even turn up any search results with that heading! What it does turn up – on the third search result, after two items titled "LNC Meeting" and "LNC 12-10-2016 Meeting - Alexandria", is a result titled "LNC Meeting Archives", and under that link, in smaller non-clickable text, "Libertarian National Committee Policy Manual". Clicking on the "continue reading" link below that takes you to the aforementioned page where the link to the Policy Manual actually appears.
And you pretty much have to get to the LNC Policy Manual by clicking through other pages on LP.org in some manner such as described above rather than simply remembering the actual link and typing it into your browser, because as far as I know the document doesn't appear under any simple, logical URL such as "lp.org/policymanual" but instead appears at this link:
https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/LNC_Policy_Manual_Adopted_2016...
Note that this link is to a PDF document, not a normal webpage. As such, I find that it scrolls much more slowly than most of the material on the site, making it more time-consuming to look through it for information. Anyway, regarding data sharing, "Not quite what our policy is" turns out to be a significant understatement! But I'll address that in the "Membership List for South Carolina" thread, and in a separate motion to revise that section of the Policy Manual.
Meanwhile, to address the problems noted above about accessing the Policy Manual and the information it contains, I move the following:
MOTION ------------------------------------------------------------------- I move that the LNC direct staff to make the following changes to the website, unless the IT Committee, a member thereof, or other individual who has the necessary website access indicates to the LNC that they can and will see that these changes are made prior to the start of the next LNC meeting on August 19, 2017:
1) Add a link at the bottom of the main page of LP.org labeled "LNC Policy Manual", that links directly to a detailed table of contents for the current version of that document with clickable links for each section and subsection (listed by title), which take viewers to that section or subsection in the full text of the document (on a normal web page rather than a PDF document, at the discretion of those making the changes).
2) Have the URL LP.org/PolicyManual (and/or the URLs LP.org/Policy_Manual, LP.org/LNC_Policy_Manual, and/or LP.org/LNCPolicyManual at the discretion of those making the changes) linked to the current version of the LNC Policy Manual table of contents page described above. -------------------------------------------------------------------
The LNC Policy Manual is a very important document that should not be kept hidden. LP members, not just LNC members, have an interest in knowing what's in it. For instance, the "data sharing with affiliates" section noted by the secretary includes language stating:
"...it is the responsibility of the affiliate chair to make sure the appropriate database contacts are on the database announce e-mail list" [emphasis added]
These common-sense changes will make it faster and easier for all of us to access the document and find what we're looking for in it. I respectfully request my LNC colleagues to co-sponsor the motion.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 5, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Alicia Mattson wrote:
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it.
-Alicia
On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Dan, That's why I wrote it to specifically give those who may have access and the ability to get this done the opportunity to step forward and say they can get those changes made, before the motion becomes a directive to staff. If most of the LNC agrees the Policy Manual is too hard to find, then we shouldn't have a problem with ensuring the issue is addressed one way or another by getting this motion passed. I was presuming a link added to the bottom of the main LP.org page would also show up at the bottom of other pages on the site, but I very much like your suggestion of having a link to the LNC Policy Manual appear separately on the Bylaws page as well. Love & Liberty, ((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF On Jun 5, 2017, at 4:52 AM, Daniel Hayes wrote:
Starchild,
I don't think we need a motion for that. I think most of the LNC agrees that the policy manual is hard to find.
I think there should probably be a link to it on the bylaws page. That's always the place I think to look. I think there should be a link from the LNC page on the website. And I don't see any reason not to have a link right there with all the other links at the bottom of the LNC page.
Daniel Hayes LNC At Large Member
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 5, 2017, at 5:31 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Thank you for the correction, Alicia. It would be helpful, when you point out stuff like this, to include the language of the policy in question, the link to the LNC Policy Manual, and the section # or page # in the document, not just a suggested search term, as the Policy Manual isn't that easy to find on our website. LNC members may know you can get to it by clicking on a different topic ("LNC Meeting Archives") at the bottom of the main LP.org page (even if we can't necessarily recall the 66-page document's contents!) but many others may not.
Why the Policy Manual is listed on the "LNC Meeting Archives" page rather than having its own page has never been clear to me (at least not without getting into speculation about possible motives), since it isn't an archive of one of our meetings, but a current governing document.
Not only is it buried under an inaccurate heading, but using the site search feature (at the top of the LP.org main page and most if not all other pages in the site) to look for "LNC Policy Manual" doesn't even turn up any search results with that heading! What it does turn up – on the third search result, after two items titled "LNC Meeting" and "LNC 12-10-2016 Meeting - Alexandria", is a result titled "LNC Meeting Archives", and under that link, in smaller non-clickable text, "Libertarian National Committee Policy Manual". Clicking on the "continue reading" link below that takes you to the aforementioned page where the link to the Policy Manual actually appears.
And you pretty much have to get to the LNC Policy Manual by clicking through other pages on LP.org in some manner such as described above rather than simply remembering the actual link and typing it into your browser, because as far as I know the document doesn't appear under any simple, logical URL such as "lp.org/policymanual" but instead appears at this link:
https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/LNC_Policy_Manual_Adopted_2016...
Note that this link is to a PDF document, not a normal webpage. As such, I find that it scrolls much more slowly than most of the material on the site, making it more time-consuming to look through it for information. Anyway, regarding data sharing, "Not quite what our policy is" turns out to be a significant understatement! But I'll address that in the "Membership List for South Carolina" thread, and in a separate motion to revise that section of the Policy Manual.
Meanwhile, to address the problems noted above about accessing the Policy Manual and the information it contains, I move the following:
MOTION ------------------------------------------------------------------- I move that the LNC direct staff to make the following changes to the website, unless the IT Committee, a member thereof, or other individual who has the necessary website access indicates to the LNC that they can and will see that these changes are made prior to the start of the next LNC meeting on August 19, 2017:
1) Add a link at the bottom of the main page of LP.org labeled "LNC Policy Manual", that links directly to a detailed table of contents for the current version of that document with clickable links for each section and subsection (listed by title), which take viewers to that section or subsection in the full text of the document (on a normal web page rather than a PDF document, at the discretion of those making the changes).
2) Have the URL LP.org/PolicyManual (and/or the URLs LP.org/Policy_Manual, LP.org/LNC_Policy_Manual, and/or LP.org/LNCPolicyManual at the discretion of those making the changes) linked to the current version of the LNC Policy Manual table of contents page described above. -------------------------------------------------------------------
The LNC Policy Manual is a very important document that should not be kept hidden. LP members, not just LNC members, have an interest in knowing what's in it. For instance, the "data sharing with affiliates" section noted by the secretary includes language stating:
"...it is the responsibility of the affiliate chair to make sure the appropriate database contacts are on the database announce e-mail list" [emphasis added]
These common-sense changes will make it faster and easier for all of us to access the document and find what we're looking for in it. I respectfully request my LNC colleagues to co-sponsor the motion.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 5, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Alicia Mattson wrote:
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it.
-Alicia
On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Wes, What can we do to make the policy manual more accessible on the website? Daniel Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 5, 2017, at 5:31 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Thank you for the correction, Alicia. It would be helpful, when you point out stuff like this, to include the language of the policy in question, the link to the LNC Policy Manual, and the section # or page # in the document, not just a suggested search term, as the Policy Manual isn't that easy to find on our website. LNC members may know you can get to it by clicking on a different topic ("LNC Meeting Archives") at the bottom of the main LP.org page (even if we can't necessarily recall the 66-page document's contents!) but many others may not.
Why the Policy Manual is listed on the "LNC Meeting Archives" page rather than having its own page has never been clear to me (at least not without getting into speculation about possible motives), since it isn't an archive of one of our meetings, but a current governing document.
Not only is it buried under an inaccurate heading, but using the site search feature (at the top of the LP.org main page and most if not all other pages in the site) to look for "LNC Policy Manual" doesn't even turn up any search results with that heading! What it does turn up – on the third search result, after two items titled "LNC Meeting" and "LNC 12-10-2016 Meeting - Alexandria", is a result titled "LNC Meeting Archives", and under that link, in smaller non-clickable text, "Libertarian National Committee Policy Manual". Clicking on the "continue reading" link below that takes you to the aforementioned page where the link to the Policy Manual actually appears.
And you pretty much have to get to the LNC Policy Manual by clicking through other pages on LP.org in some manner such as described above rather than simply remembering the actual link and typing it into your browser, because as far as I know the document doesn't appear under any simple, logical URL such as "lp.org/policymanual" but instead appears at this link:
https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/LNC_Policy_Manual_Adopted_2016...
Note that this link is to a PDF document, not a normal webpage. As such, I find that it scrolls much more slowly than most of the material on the site, making it more time-consuming to look through it for information. Anyway, regarding data sharing, "Not quite what our policy is" turns out to be a significant understatement! But I'll address that in the "Membership List for South Carolina" thread, and in a separate motion to revise that section of the Policy Manual.
Meanwhile, to address the problems noted above about accessing the Policy Manual and the information it contains, I move the following:
MOTION ------------------------------------------------------------------- I move that the LNC direct staff to make the following changes to the website, unless the IT Committee, a member thereof, or other individual who has the necessary website access indicates to the LNC that they can and will see that these changes are made prior to the start of the next LNC meeting on August 19, 2017:
1) Add a link at the bottom of the main page of LP.org labeled "LNC Policy Manual", that links directly to a detailed table of contents for the current version of that document with clickable links for each section and subsection (listed by title), which take viewers to that section or subsection in the full text of the document (on a normal web page rather than a PDF document, at the discretion of those making the changes).
2) Have the URL LP.org/PolicyManual (and/or the URLs LP.org/Policy_Manual, LP.org/LNC_Policy_Manual, and/or LP.org/LNCPolicyManual at the discretion of those making the changes) linked to the current version of the LNC Policy Manual table of contents page described above. -------------------------------------------------------------------
The LNC Policy Manual is a very important document that should not be kept hidden. LP members, not just LNC members, have an interest in knowing what's in it. For instance, the "data sharing with affiliates" section noted by the secretary includes language stating:
"...it is the responsibility of the affiliate chair to make sure the appropriate database contacts are on the database announce e-mail list" [emphasis added]
These common-sense changes will make it faster and easier for all of us to access the document and find what we're looking for in it. I respectfully request my LNC colleagues to co-sponsor the motion.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 5, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Alicia Mattson wrote:
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it.
-Alicia
On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Unless something changes things, I'll take care if it in about 2 weeks. Will do a few other reorganization things at the same time. Yep, it's hard to find. Wes
On Jun 5, 2017, at 7:05 AM, Daniel Hayes <danielehayes@icloud.com> wrote:
Wes,
What can we do to make the policy manual more accessible on the website?
Daniel
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 5, 2017, at 5:31 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Thank you for the correction, Alicia. It would be helpful, when you point out stuff like this, to include the language of the policy in question, the link to the LNC Policy Manual, and the section # or page # in the document, not just a suggested search term, as the Policy Manual isn't that easy to find on our website. LNC members may know you can get to it by clicking on a different topic ("LNC Meeting Archives") at the bottom of the main LP.org page (even if we can't necessarily recall the 66-page document's contents!) but many others may not.
Why the Policy Manual is listed on the "LNC Meeting Archives" page rather than having its own page has never been clear to me (at least not without getting into speculation about possible motives), since it isn't an archive of one of our meetings, but a current governing document.
Not only is it buried under an inaccurate heading, but using the site search feature (at the top of the LP.org main page and most if not all other pages in the site) to look for "LNC Policy Manual" doesn't even turn up any search results with that heading! What it does turn up – on the third search result, after two items titled "LNC Meeting" and "LNC 12-10-2016 Meeting - Alexandria", is a result titled "LNC Meeting Archives", and under that link, in smaller non-clickable text, "Libertarian National Committee Policy Manual". Clicking on the "continue reading" link below that takes you to the aforementioned page where the link to the Policy Manual actually appears.
And you pretty much have to get to the LNC Policy Manual by clicking through other pages on LP.org in some manner such as described above rather than simply remembering the actual link and typing it into your browser, because as far as I know the document doesn't appear under any simple, logical URL such as "lp.org/policymanual" but instead appears at this link:
https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/LNC_Policy_Manual_Adopted_2016...
Note that this link is to a PDF document, not a normal webpage. As such, I find that it scrolls much more slowly than most of the material on the site, making it more time-consuming to look through it for information. Anyway, regarding data sharing, "Not quite what our policy is" turns out to be a significant understatement! But I'll address that in the "Membership List for South Carolina" thread, and in a separate motion to revise that section of the Policy Manual.
Meanwhile, to address the problems noted above about accessing the Policy Manual and the information it contains, I move the following:
MOTION ------------------------------------------------------------------- I move that the LNC direct staff to make the following changes to the website, unless the IT Committee, a member thereof, or other individual who has the necessary website access indicates to the LNC that they can and will see that these changes are made prior to the start of the next LNC meeting on August 19, 2017:
1) Add a link at the bottom of the main page of LP.org labeled "LNC Policy Manual", that links directly to a detailed table of contents for the current version of that document with clickable links for each section and subsection (listed by title), which take viewers to that section or subsection in the full text of the document (on a normal web page rather than a PDF document, at the discretion of those making the changes).
2) Have the URL LP.org/PolicyManual (and/or the URLs LP.org/Policy_Manual, LP.org/LNC_Policy_Manual, and/or LP.org/LNCPolicyManual at the discretion of those making the changes) linked to the current version of the LNC Policy Manual table of contents page described above. -------------------------------------------------------------------
The LNC Policy Manual is a very important document that should not be kept hidden. LP members, not just LNC members, have an interest in knowing what's in it. For instance, the "data sharing with affiliates" section noted by the secretary includes language stating:
"...it is the responsibility of the affiliate chair to make sure the appropriate database contacts are on the database announce e-mail list" [emphasis added]
These common-sense changes will make it faster and easier for all of us to access the document and find what we're looking for in it. I respectfully request my LNC colleagues to co-sponsor the motion.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 5, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Alicia Mattson wrote:
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it.
-Alicia
On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Thanks Wes! You're the best! Daniel Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 5, 2017, at 11:19 PM, Wes Benedict <wes.benedict@lp.org> wrote:
Unless something changes things, I'll take care if it in about 2 weeks. Will do a few other reorganization things at the same time. Yep, it's hard to find.
Wes
On Jun 5, 2017, at 7:05 AM, Daniel Hayes <danielehayes@icloud.com> wrote:
Wes,
What can we do to make the policy manual more accessible on the website?
Daniel
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 5, 2017, at 5:31 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
Thank you for the correction, Alicia. It would be helpful, when you point out stuff like this, to include the language of the policy in question, the link to the LNC Policy Manual, and the section # or page # in the document, not just a suggested search term, as the Policy Manual isn't that easy to find on our website. LNC members may know you can get to it by clicking on a different topic ("LNC Meeting Archives") at the bottom of the main LP.org page (even if we can't necessarily recall the 66-page document's contents!) but many others may not.
Why the Policy Manual is listed on the "LNC Meeting Archives" page rather than having its own page has never been clear to me (at least not without getting into speculation about possible motives), since it isn't an archive of one of our meetings, but a current governing document.
Not only is it buried under an inaccurate heading, but using the site search feature (at the top of the LP.org main page and most if not all other pages in the site) to look for "LNC Policy Manual" doesn't even turn up any search results with that heading! What it does turn up – on the third search result, after two items titled "LNC Meeting" and "LNC 12-10-2016 Meeting - Alexandria", is a result titled "LNC Meeting Archives", and under that link, in smaller non-clickable text, "Libertarian National Committee Policy Manual". Clicking on the "continue reading" link below that takes you to the aforementioned page where the link to the Policy Manual actually appears.
And you pretty much have to get to the LNC Policy Manual by clicking through other pages on LP.org in some manner such as described above rather than simply remembering the actual link and typing it into your browser, because as far as I know the document doesn't appear under any simple, logical URL such as "lp.org/policymanual" but instead appears at this link:
https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/LNC_Policy_Manual_Adopted_2016...
Note that this link is to a PDF document, not a normal webpage. As such, I find that it scrolls much more slowly than most of the material on the site, making it more time-consuming to look through it for information. Anyway, regarding data sharing, "Not quite what our policy is" turns out to be a significant understatement! But I'll address that in the "Membership List for South Carolina" thread, and in a separate motion to revise that section of the Policy Manual.
Meanwhile, to address the problems noted above about accessing the Policy Manual and the information it contains, I move the following:
MOTION ------------------------------------------------------------------- I move that the LNC direct staff to make the following changes to the website, unless the IT Committee, a member thereof, or other individual who has the necessary website access indicates to the LNC that they can and will see that these changes are made prior to the start of the next LNC meeting on August 19, 2017:
1) Add a link at the bottom of the main page of LP.org labeled "LNC Policy Manual", that links directly to a detailed table of contents for the current version of that document with clickable links for each section and subsection (listed by title), which take viewers to that section or subsection in the full text of the document (on a normal web page rather than a PDF document, at the discretion of those making the changes).
2) Have the URL LP.org/PolicyManual (and/or the URLs LP.org/Policy_Manual, LP.org/LNC_Policy_Manual, and/or LP.org/LNCPolicyManual at the discretion of those making the changes) linked to the current version of the LNC Policy Manual table of contents page described above. -------------------------------------------------------------------
The LNC Policy Manual is a very important document that should not be kept hidden. LP members, not just LNC members, have an interest in knowing what's in it. For instance, the "data sharing with affiliates" section noted by the secretary includes language stating:
"...it is the responsibility of the affiliate chair to make sure the appropriate database contacts are on the database announce e-mail list" [emphasis added]
These common-sense changes will make it faster and easier for all of us to access the document and find what we're looking for in it. I respectfully request my LNC colleagues to co-sponsor the motion.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 5, 2017, at 12:35 AM, Alicia Mattson wrote:
Starchild, your characterization below is not quite what our policy is. If you'll search the policy manual for "data sharing with affiliates", you'll find it.
-Alicia
On Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 5:03 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer@earthlink.net> wrote:
James,
Thank you for sharing your concern, and Arvin for bringing it to our attention. Has Travis McCurry asked the national office to copy you on membership updates for South Carolina when they get sent out? It's my understanding that any elected state LP leader is can receive the data from national for their state if they ask for it, at which point you could presumably get from him the lists of members in your counties, if your chair refuses to provide it for some reason. But I'd like to hear Stewart's response, and what issues(s) he may have regarding the formatting of the list. Not wanting to share membership data with county leaders doesn't sound in keeping with what if I recall correctly has been his usual support for transparency.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee RealReform@earthlink.net (415) 625-FREE @StarchildSF
On Jun 4, 2017, at 11:47 AM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
Hi all - can someone help with this, if doing so is within our purview?
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: James Brandmair <jamesbrandmair@gmail.com> Date: Sun, Jun 4, 2017 at 2:45 PM Subject: Membership List for South Carolina To: "vicechair@lp.org" <vicechair@lp.org>
Arvin,
Harper Sharp and I have been dissatisfied with the LP in our state so we took it upon ourselves to start being the change we wanted to see. Over the last month and a half we have come to find out that the state party is incompetent and unmotivated. Furthermore we have concluded that the main reason for that is Stewart Flood, our state chair. There's been many instances of him holding the party back for reasons that can only appear as him trying to maintain control over it. The biggest issue being that he isn't fulfilling his duty in membership recruitment by utilizing and distributing the membership list he receives from national. He's made a number of excuses saying that National doesn't send him the list, to when he does get the membership list the formatting is confusing. His vice chair, Travis McCurry, isn't even aware when he gets membership list at times, and he wants to grow the party just as much as we do. Furthermore, our county chairmen are not getting the membership list from Stewart Flood so they can actively recruit in their respective areas. To get to the point of all this, is that we are hoping you can help us get the membership list for our state, South Carolina; or at least Lexington and Richland county, so that we can get out there in the field and start communicating with people to get them more involved in the liberty movement.
Thanks for all you do,
James Brandmair & Harper Sharp
-- Arvin Vohra
www.VoteVohra.com VoteVohra@gmail.com (301) 320-3634 _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
participants (5)
-
Alicia Mattson -
Arvin Vohra -
Daniel Hayes -
Starchild -
Wes Benedict