Motion to be considered at November LNC meeting
In order to not have this debate 200 times at the next meeting, I propose the following: 1. LNC members who request to be addressed without Mr. or Ms. should receive this courtesy from the chair. I would like to set aside 15 seconds or less for discussion. The purpose of "Mr." or "Mrs." is to show respect to our fellow LNC members. If using one of those titles instead does not show that person respect, then it defeats the entire purpose. We can get into all sorts of abstract discussion about the notion of gender itself being a socially constructed method to maintain the status quo, but I don't think we need to take it that far. If an LNC member makes a reasonable request for courtesy, it seems pretty obvious that we should honor that request. -Arvin
Thanks, Arvin. :-) It probably won't come as a surprise that I support your motion and the intent behind it, but would suggest adding the words "and other members" after "chair". Hopefully if there is any discussion, we can discuss it online now and not take up any time at the meeting (even 15 seconds, although I don't see what could possibly be discussed in such a short increment anyway!). Love & Liberty, ((( starchild ))) At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee On Oct 29, 2012, at 3:35 PM, Arvin Vohra wrote:
In order to not have this debate 200 times at the next meeting, I propose the following:
1. LNC members who request to be addressed without Mr. or Ms. should receive this courtesy from the chair.
I would like to set aside 15 seconds or less for discussion. The purpose of "Mr." or "Mrs." is to show respect to our fellow LNC members. If using one of those titles instead does not show that person respect, then it defeats the entire purpose.
We can get into all sorts of abstract discussion about the notion of gender itself being a socially constructed method to maintain the status quo, but I don't think we need to take it that far. If an LNC member makes a reasonable request for courtesy, it seems pretty obvious that we should honor that request.
-Arvin _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
Arvin, I understand and agree with the sentiments behind your proposal, that the courteous thing to do is to address people in the manner they prefer. For example, if a woman wants her prefix to be Miss or Mrs. or Ms. or nothing, I'm happy to oblige. Starchild prefers "Starchild" and that's what I call him. But courtesy isn't something that's easily legislated or regulated. It's either extended by one person to another or it isn't. I'm not opposed to all standards of conduct. For example, if we began addressing fellow LNC members as "assholes" or "scumbags" or other more colorful terms, that would exceed the normal rules of decorum (both implicitly and under Robert's Rules) and would require corrective action. But this doesn't rise to that level, and we ought to be able to deal with it in a more informal manner. Dan On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 3:35 PM, Arvin Vohra <arvin@arvinvohra.com> wrote:
In order to not have this debate 200 times at the next meeting, I propose the following:
1. LNC members who request to be addressed without Mr. or Ms. should receive this courtesy from the chair.
I would like to set aside 15 seconds or less for discussion. The purpose of "Mr." or "Mrs." is to show respect to our fellow LNC members. If using one of those titles instead does not show that person respect, then it defeats the entire purpose.
We can get into all sorts of abstract discussion about the notion of gender itself being a socially constructed method to maintain the status quo, but I don't think we need to take it that far. If an LNC member makes a reasonable request for courtesy, it seems pretty obvious that we should honor that request.
-Arvin
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
If we can come to an informal agreement without a motion, I'm perfectly happy to go with that, or any other option that settles the issue without creating unneeded distractions at the meeting. -Arvin On Oct 29, 2012 8:27 PM, "Daniel Wiener" <wiener@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
Arvin,
I understand and agree with the sentiments behind your proposal, that the courteous thing to do is to address people in the manner they prefer. For example, if a woman wants her prefix to be Miss or Mrs. or Ms. or nothing, I'm happy to oblige. Starchild prefers "Starchild" and that's what I call him.
But courtesy isn't something that's easily legislated or regulated. It's either extended by one person to another or it isn't. I'm not opposed to all standards of conduct. For example, if we began addressing fellow LNC members as "assholes" or "scumbags" or other more colorful terms, that would exceed the normal rules of decorum (both implicitly and under Robert's Rules) and would require corrective action. But this doesn't rise to that level, and we ought to be able to deal with it in a more informal manner.
Dan
On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 3:35 PM, Arvin Vohra <arvin@arvinvohra.com> wrote:
In order to not have this debate 200 times at the next meeting, I propose the following:
1. LNC members who request to be addressed without Mr. or Ms. should receive this courtesy from the chair.
I would like to set aside 15 seconds or less for discussion. The purpose of "Mr." or "Mrs." is to show respect to our fellow LNC members. If using one of those titles instead does not show that person respect, then it defeats the entire purpose.
We can get into all sorts of abstract discussion about the notion of gender itself being a socially constructed method to maintain the status quo, but I don't think we need to take it that far. If an LNC member makes a reasonable request for courtesy, it seems pretty obvious that we should honor that request.
-Arvin
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
The motion would need to be crafted to constrain the speech of every member. After all, every member who speaks can address any other member when that member has the floor. This motion would constrain Mr. Wrights when he is chairing (is that really a word?) but not when he is not, by example.. Do you wish to alter your motion? Geoff Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -----Original Message----- From: Arvin Vohra <rolandmediadistribution@gmail.com> Sender: "Lnc-business" <lnc-business-bounces@hq.lp.org> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2012 19:44:30 To: <lnc-business@hq.lp.org> Reply-To: lnc-business@hq.lp.org Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] Motion to be considered at November LNC meeting _______________________________________________ Lnc-business mailing list Lnc-business@hq.lp.org http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
participants (5)
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Arvin Vohra -
Arvin Vohra -
Daniel Wiener -
liber8or＠austin.rr.com -
Starchild